Dead Man Walking (Part 1): Why Jesus Died and Why It Still Matters (Lent 1)

Speaker A: 00:00:06

Welcome to Heaven Earth Church. My name is Ross Stackhouse. I'm the founding pastor of Heaven Earth Church.

From the beginning, our heart was to be a church for people who don't fit neatly into church. Our heart is to meet people where they are, to learn their stories, to honor their stories. Because in every human story is God's story.

In this podcast, you'll hear more about the people who now call Heaven Earth Church home. Their stories, in many cases of misfits who are discovering or rediscovering faith.

If you want to know more about us, you can go to heavenorthchurch.org Otherwise, we invite you now into the story.

Speaker B: 00:00:47

Hello, good people. Brad Miller here, the producer of the Heaven Earth Church podcast.

One of the main benefits of being a part of the Heaven Earth Church community is our Sunday morning conversations taught by founding pastor Ross Stackhouse. You can watch and participate in the Sunday morning conversation this Sunday morning, 9:30am Eastern time at YouTube.com heavenerthchurch.

,: 2025

Speaker A: 00:01:58

All right, let's have a prayer and then have our Sunday conversation.

Lord, I pray that you would open our eyes to see, open our ears to hear, open our hearts to receive the wisdom and the love that you so eagerly desire to give us for life, for eternal life. In Jesus name, Amen. So, Hudson, I'm need your help today. Is this your first start today on the visuals? Oh, dude, I'm so sorry. My phone isn't working.

Hudson. So baptism by fire, my friend. There's a slide that talks about. It's got the word haunted on it. Look at that. Haunting.

Perfect one for one from the field. Let's go.

So when you think of the word haunting, maybe you think of, you know, something scary and bad, but in the true sense of the word, it's just that it's something poignant, something that evokes emotion, something that's difficult to ignore or forget. So you can of course be haunted by things that you'd rather not forget, that are scary, right?

But you can also be haunted by beautiful things, by good things that just kind of stick with you, that get into your spirit, to your heart, into your mind. So a question to ask you to begin is recently what good haunting have you had? What's something in your life that's kind of haunted you?

That like just. It stuck with you. It was so good, it was so beautiful, so wonderful that you just kept thinking about it? Maybe it was something in creation.

Maybe it was a relationship. What's something good that's haunted you recently? Melissa. Melissa's niece. Her little niece is having a breakthrough with speech.

So it's exciting to watch her discover the ability to communicate what she wants, who she wants. What good thing has been in your life recently that's made it. It's been difficult to ignore. It's poignant, evocative.

Bobo, out of all the youth that Bobo works with, she has somebody she works with who's celebrating 30 days of sobriety. Two of them those first 30 days. Hard, hard. Wonder hard. Yeah. What else? Something good that's haunting you, sticking with you. You can't ignore it.

Jim, working with my granddaughter on the.

Speaker C: 00:05:59

Girl Scout cookies, it's just ideal. I look forward every year. It's just a fun thing to do and to see her.

Speaker A: 00:06:11

Jim getting to work with his granddaughter every year selling Girl Scout cookies just because you get to eat them. Jen, you get. That's your pay. You just get a samp as you go. No, getting to collaborate with your granddaughter and do a project. Yeah, sure.

A good thing. A God thing. That's difficult to ignore or forget. My. Okay, guys, jeez, get a room. Anniversary today. How many years?

18 year anniversary for my dad and Patty today. All right, congratulations. What else? PT the last lay servant academy where.

Speaker C: 00:07:06

I saw 39 light people not only get some training, but take their first steps to do leadership in their local churches.

Speaker A: 00:07:15

Yeah, that just, you know, I'm retired now. I don't want to do anything anymore.

Speaker C: 00:07:22

But I'm committing myself to teaching classes.

Speaker A: 00:07:24

In that because it's so exciting, especially.

Speaker C: 00:07:28

With younger people to see something happen.

Speaker A: 00:07:32

To God like that. Yeah. So pts participated in something called Lay Servant Academy. You don't know what that means?

In our United Methodist, where I'm ordained United Methodist pastor PT is as well. So there's like clergy who are the ordained folks and folks who are not, who are lay people.

And this academy trains lay people to take leadership in their local church and kind of come alive in their gifts. And he saw 39 people get receive training. That's exciting for sure. Yeah. What else? Joanna?

Speaker C: 00:08:10

I've had several haunting stories, hauntingly good stories, but one most recently is that our cousin passed away unexpectedly. And I'm reluctant to share it, but it's just too much to share.

Speaker A: 00:08:33

Joanna, is this about the letter? Okay, never mind. Go ahead.

Speaker C: 00:08:40

Well, I'm not going that deep into it, but the Lord kind of nudged me and kept kind of presenting his name to me roughly a year ago. And I went and visited him twice. And his life changed a lot months prior to his passing. So it's still so fresh because he passed away last week.

But just. It's like hunting with good.

It's like, you know, of course we miss him and we're grieving in the family, but I'm so glad that the Lord sent me or told me. The Lord kind of nudged me to go see him, and he was not what you call a believer.

Speaker A: 00:09:23

The reason I asked Joanne is because that's my first story about haunting. We were haunted in a wonderful way, in a terrible way. Our cousin, my dad's stepbrother, his son that we grew up very close to.

My dad doesn't have any siblings, but our. His stepbrother's Uncle Ron. To me, our cousin died unexpectedly. He was 50. And I did his funeral this past week.

And so, of course, that was sort of haunting in a bad way. But that's kind of our existence as human beings. Sometimes the good that haunts you is right next to the bad that haunts you.

And I was going to tell this story anonymously, but since she outed herself, I didn't want to tell it without her permission, but she just gave me permission. We were in a series called Discipleship Essentials. Can you name them? Name a discipleship essential. Any of the five. These are the essentials.

We say that if we practice these, then we're going to be fruitful and flourishing as people of Jesus. There are things we just want to practice together. Can you name any of them? Humble, hungry and willing to seek. Jesus is essential number two.

That means, like, whatever's going on, we want to just know, what did Jesus say? What did Jesus do? That's what we want to be about. We want to give up everything that we think we know to go pursue that. Tucker Sent.

That's the easiest one to remember. Everyone's like, dang it, Tucker. That was the one. I was going to say.

The we take seriously that Jesus is sending us to people and places for a purpose that may not be clear yet. That's the fourth one. There's three left. Yes. Shaped by God from the inside out, by continuous companionship with God. So we're not.

It's, hey, this is beautiful. Don't give up. Our gathering together. In community, we're not just checking a box. Like, community is so powerful.

We practice community spiritual practice together. It's so important. But you also want to do it on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday.

Develop a continuous friendship with God and be shaped by that from the inside out. You got three of them. There's only two left. You're a cheater. You're on staff. No, thank you. Thank you. No, you get one help.

You get one phone a friend from Emily. Okay. Grace and the great commands at the core. At the end of the day, Jesus was asked, what's the most important law or command in the law?

The first five books. He says, love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul and strength. That he says, wait, wait, wait, I'm not done.

The second is, like it, love your neighbor as yourself. The law and the prophets depend on these two. And grace. If we're like, well, how what is love? The answer to that is grace.

God just pours out love to us in a way that's extravagant and we're not necessarily deserving of it. God says, I declare you deserving of it because it's what I say. Grace and the great commands at the core of our lives.

And the last one, I'll give it to you, is collaboration. That we are a part of big good news and God could do it without us, but God refuses to.

Each of us has a part to play in God's big news mission to restore all of creation. I wanted to review those because you need to pass the test coming up, and I don't want you to fail. No, I'm just kidding.

Essential 4 My sister took seriously. She's out of the room. Good. We'll talk about her while she's not here. I was not going to do it by name, but my cousin's name was on her heart.

She felt sent to him. She responded. She wrote him a long letter. He was kind of lonely, spent a lot of time to himself.

It wasn't secret that he had some struggles, but, gosh, a heart of gold. People said that independently of this guy, like, he had a heart of gold.

So this person I'm telling you about, she's sitting down right now, decided to write him a letter expressing how wonderful he is to him, how worthy he is of love. And she beared witness to her faith. Not a script like, hey, man, if you die today, do you know where you're going?

Like, no, hey, here's who Jesus is to me. I just want you to know that. And tried to pass that on to Him. So this was in January or like around Christmas time.

Well, then he died last week and I was sitting with the family and wouldn't you know it, in the two months since that letter, he had gone to treatment, he sought the help that he needed and he was somewhat estranged from some family, his daughters. Six days before he died, he called and had an hour long conversation with a daughter that he hadn't spoken with basically in two years.

And he left a voicemail to his other daughter that like she said she'll have for the rest of her life. It's terribly tragic that he died. We're mourning that.

But we're also haunted by this like this hope that we have in this situation that I don't know if she did it or not. Something changed and we're haunted by like man, what if Jesus is more wonderful and bizarre and good than I've ever dreamed like.

And yes, there's this reality alongside. Yeah, but somebody died. But that's being human. It's like we can't, that's, that's the hauntings that you can't reconcile the two things.

Like something wonderful, like and hopeful is a part of this tragedy because of Jesus Sending and what I want to tell you today, there's a one thing, Hudson, that talks about how Jesus is not a myth or a theory. I think this story like haunted us in a way that it's like Jesus isn't a ghost story, myth or theory.

Though sometimes throughout history there are literally these things called theories of atonement, things that explain why Jesus died. And people have argued over the ages about the right philosophy for understanding why Jesus died and why he lived, all these theological theories.

But like to Paul, the guy who wrote so many letters in the New Testament, Jesus wasn't a theory. He was real. He was so real that he was willing to give up everything to follow him and pass on this legacy to other people.

Jesus was a dead man walking who haunted and saved people. I'll tell you why this series is called that. There's a picture if you want to go to that for the series. You know where that's from?

Ronald, that picture. We were there together, sir, from the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Israel. There's this amazing panoramic painting of Holy Week.

And this is what we're doing for Lent is we're in a series called Dead man why Jesus Died and why it Still Matters for Ordinary People. I am not interested in this series in getting you to believe the right theory for atonement. Or the right philosophy for exactly why Jesus died.

I have these questions in mind. There are some questions. Hudson on a slide. Why was. Why was the way he lived so haunting for people?

Why did so many ordinary people believe at great cost to themselves. At great cost to themselves. And why did he die? He didn't die on accident. Can you go to Mark chapter eight, Hudson?

Let's give Hudson a round of applause, please. He got his first start. He was put into the starting lineup today. And like, boom. It's like, hey, man, it's going to be harder than normal.

Jesus made a prediction like this three times. In the Gospel of Mark, there are four accounts of Jesus life. They're called gospels. It's a word that means good news.

We talked about that word last week. Good news. Mark, chapter 8, verse 31. It's right in the middle of the gospel. He began to teach his disciples or his followers.

Disciples, a word that means like apprentice.

Somebody's learning a trade, the human one or the son of man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, chief priests and the legal experts, all the VIPs of religion and be killed and then after three days, rise from the dead. He said this plainly. Jesus didn't talk plainly often. This time he was plain and Peter was like, get over here, young man. You can't be saying that.

And Jesus said not so kind thing back to him in return. He predicted something like this two more times. Jesus didn't die on accident.

There's some kind of thinking out there that, no, actually Jesus didn't die on purpose. It was kind of an accidental, inconsequential, not inconsequential, accidental consequence of the way he lived. I could give that some credence.

Except every gospel basically shows Jesus saying he meant to do it. Why? He had a clock. From the minute he started his ministry, he was a dead man walking for three years. He was a dead man walking.

He had three years to live. He knew that his clock was ticking. And while he lived those three years as a dead man walking, things he said and he did haunted people.

They couldn't let go of it. They couldn't ignore. Evoked something in them that was dead.

They'd be around Jesus for five minutes and then for the next five days he'd be like, what was that guy? He's so weird and so wonderful. I want to be weird like him. I don't want to be normal like these people over here that are the religious leaders.

I want to be weird like him because he's weird. And wonderful and life giving. They were haunted by him.

But then, of course, what we're building to is April 20, which is Easter, when they swore, literally, I know, it's a challenge to our rational brains. They swore that this man who is dead, crucified, was now up and walking. So in another sense, he was a dead man walking. He was raised.

And that also haunted them like nothing else. And then it started this movement where people were willing to give their lives to say, he is the one. He is the anointed one of God.

He has come to save us and free us and restore all of creation. When people like Pliny the Younger. What? Who?

Pliny the Younger was a governor in modern day Turkey in About the year 111, he wrote a letter to the emperor Trajan, the emperor of the leader of the entire world, the.

The leader of the not so free world, and said, hey, Trajan, what do I do about all these people who are, like, meeting on Sundays and they're singing songs and eating and they're worshiping some guy who was dead and raised like he's a God? My practice is to beat the tar out of them. And then if they recant, I let them go. If they don't, I kill them. What do you think?

And Trajan writes back, this is such an issue at this point. Trajan writes back and is like, good job, bud. Keep it up. Something like that. Why would people do that? It was a cult, Ross. Cults don't survive.

They don't. The history of them survives, but, like, the actual movement itself doesn't. They were haunted by something. Something so incredibly wonderful. Why?

Why was the way he lived so haunting that people would just sign up repeatedly for three centuries to claim this guy at great expense, at great cost? Why did he die? And his name means. Do you know what Jesus means? That name? It's a Hebrew name. Aramaic. Jesus.

In the Christmas story, the angel says, you will name him Jesus because he will save us. Jesus means he saves or God saves. How on earth does this guy's death save us? Huh? What? How does he save us?

I want to talk with you about that up until Easter. And my hope is that by Easter, you believe something that's yours. Maybe for the first time or again, you. I. Sorry.

I literally hope to have you leave this series haunted. In a good way. Not that it gives you nightmares, but it has you walking free. It has you walking hopeful.

It has you walking convicted that he is for you, that he did come to save you. And you have some little inkling of what that means. And it fuels you to love people in the way that he has loved you.

So you can tell people, I went to church today and the pastor said this weird thing that he wants us to be haunted by Easter. What a jerk. It's exactly right. I hope you're haunted by Easter. By the goodness of this weird guy named Jesus. I want to ask you this, though.

Today's just an introductory. By the way, I don't really have a big one point for today. I just want to introduce my goal to haunt you. Hey.

But I do want to give you space to determine the rest of the series. It's like choose your own adventure in a book. When you think, can you back those questions? Hudson? These are some of my questions.

What questions do you have about like, Jesus death and how it saves us?

Are there questions that you that have been stirring in you specifically about like, why Jesus life saves us or why his death saves us or something like that? Maybe you're like, I don't know. I just showed up to church today. I'm tired, wanted more sleep. Something got me out of bed.

My kid drugged me to church today or my parent drug me to church. Are there questions that have been unresolved for you? Yeah.

Speaker C: 00:26:56

White people have trouble believing that Jesus was raised from the dead when he raised people before Lazarus and the different ones and the son of the rich man and all this kind of thing, they seen it done, but yet they can't believe that that happened to him.

Speaker A: 00:27:15

So Jim is wondering why people struggle so much to believe that Jesus was raised from the dead. Okay, good question. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What else? What questions do you have around these. These subjects? His name means he saves. Really?

How does his life and death save? Why did he die? Why should I care? What questions do you have along those lines?

Otherwise you're co signing my questions and that's what we're going with for this series. So you had your shot. Don't come back. Be like, this series stunk. I didn't like it. I'm not haunted. I'm just bored. PT.

Speaker C: 00:28:15

Jesus become more than human.

Speaker A: 00:28:19

Oh, boy. When did the human Jesus become more than human? That's an easy one. No. Okay, somebody write that down. Yeah, yeah. No. Yeah. Thank you, Adam.

Why do I need to be saved? Yeah. Yes. What? Like, yeah, somewhere along the line somebody. Yeah, yeah. Like, why do I need to be saved? I'm a good person. I do good things for people.

Like, I don't need saving. Maybe somebody does. I don't. Why? Why do I Need saving. That's an. That's an important question. Yeah.

I realize I can go back to the recording and hear your questions again, so I don't need to write them down. Anything else, Brandon? Yes. Why is blood and death the mechanism? The Bible seems to be obsessed with blood. Why?

I will hand out, by the way, all my preparation for this series. I'm doing a survey, if you call me a nerd for what I'm about to say. Well, it's my job, okay?

I'm going through the whole New Testament to find every place where it's referenced, like why he died. I can tell you in my initial, like, conclusion.

I was just saying to Alicia, like, when you go to see the mountains, it's haunting in a good way that leaves you speechless. That's what I feel in looking at this. It is not a simple answer that fits in a box like this.

People talk about the reason for why Jesus died in a multitude of ways. Yes. They used language about saving us from our sins as a ransom, rescuing us from the wrath of God. What? God isn't God love and God's wrathful.

Okay, hold on. I can't reconcile those two things. Well, I'm struggling with that, too. But all these things, and one of them is like this blood thing.

It's saved by his blood. What? We're going to talk about that the next six weeks. Kirsten.

Speaker C: 00:31:19

So Kira said a lot that we are saved not because of what we do or what we don't do, but who we are, but because of who Jesus is, and that's why we're saved. Then I also hear people say that people who haven't accepted Jesus as their savior aren't saved, so.

Speaker A: 00:31:44

Oh, interesting. Kirsten, when I say it like that, it's actually me going like, yeah, I think you're right.

Kirsten's like, she's heard that we are saved, quote, unquote, because of who Jesus is and what Jesus does. But then if you don't. If you don't accept Jesus as savior, then you're not saved. And she feels a little bit of contradiction there.

That's a good question, Hudson. Why did Jesus have to suffer so much? Hudson, you're crushing it. Today we're going to give you a raise. We're going to give you a prize.

Oh, we got another one. Let's go, Hudson. Say that again. If grace is sufficient for all, why do we need to repent? I knew you had it in you. You just had to think.

You had to think some. Now they're Coming out. Yes. We're going to do this the next six weeks. Weeks. You can send me questions. Rosseavenorthchurch.org you can text me.

Jamin, you got a question? Say it again. I couldn't hear it. Okay. Yeah. So basically, the question, like, if God is love, why is there. Why, like, there's suffering in this story.

Why is there suffering in the world? Why do so many people die in wars? Like, can't reconcile that. If God is love, why do you. Why does he let so many people die in wars, for instance?

Yeah. All right, I'm going to move on. You have time still. Okay. To send me questions.

But the reason I say this is that one thing I've realized, if I'm going to meet. If part.

If Jesus meets me where I am, if part of the story of Christianity is that God comes to meet us, I realize that for us, sometimes as Christians, we're answering questions that people aren't asking. And so, like, I wanted to know, like, what questions are people asking? So I went into this Reddit thread for atheists this past week. Spoiler alert.

I got banned yesterday. I was like, why? I didn't do anything. I didn't proselytize anyone. I looked at the ground rules. I was like, I didn't troll anyone.

I had no personal attacks. I didn't do this, do that. And then they muted me after they banned me. Darn. Jeez. Come on now. But a question that has picked up steam.

I was telling Emily about this. Did Jesus ever actually exist? This thread had tons of comments, likes. And I mean, I'll give them this. They were very well informed.

Now, part of the issue that we're dealing with in our world is misinformation. Right? But also it's that everybody has a platform to do what they want with the information. So we're kind of struggling with both. Right?

And that's why people who, like, belong to Jesus, in my opinion, like, we need to be the people who are the most committed to truthfulness. Like, wanting to, like, seek out good sources, be informed, be wise. We don't want to participate in what I've called the propaganda swamp.

So I probably got banned because I had a comment that was this long, but I didn't make any faith claims. I didn't. So I wanted. I did tell Emily I was going to.

I want to address that question to end, and that seems like a stupid thing to do because what does that have to do with anything? And then I want to tell you what I think this question is. Really about. I'm not going to go through this in detail.

First of all, I'm going to tell you historians, it's not a question Jesus existed. It's not a question. There's a small little niche of people who want to raise that argument.

It's, it's not a good argument because like I said in here, people are like, well, there are no records of his life. There shouldn't be. He was a poor non citizen stonemason who lived in an unremarkable town and got crucified like thousands of other people.

There should be no record of his life. And yet there is. There should be no record of his life within 30 years of his death.

Christians were being blamed by the emperor for stuff and they were willing to endure that blame for a myth that was concocted about a guy who didn't exist. Technically, you could be right. Odds aren't in your favor.

All right, so there was a fire in Rome and the Emperor Nero said it was the Christians who did it. And then they all got in trouble and beat up and killed and stuff. And then that just kept happening for the next three centuries.

For a story that was made up about a guy who never existed. There were no outside sources about his life in his lifetime. There were no outside sources about a ton of people from the ancient world.

That means you don't. Ooh, this sounds arrogant. Hold on, back up. That means that potentially you don't have a great grasp of how history worked in the ancient world.

There's a guy named Tacitus who is a Roman senator and historian who talks about Jesus. In 116 A.D. he existed. I got banned. I love these people. I love them. I wish I could have stayed in the conversation. I'm going to try to jump back in.

I don't think my odds are very good. I wanted to know what questions they're asking because I care about them. And I wanted to get at like, is this really an historical question for you?

And I'm going to tell you that this might be unfair to them, but it's my conclusion. I don't think they're really asking a serious historical question.

I think it's an expression of what they feel about Christianity, that it's not legitimate. And so how do you, like, what do you do when you don't think something's legitimate? You do everything you can to erase it. And they're right.

Christianity has failed to be a consistent, legitimate source of healing and hope for our world. I saw in this thread they were like, everybody was going off course about whether he existed or not.

They were instead talking about how Christians are. And that's when I knew they weren't asking whether he existed or not. They're like, yeah, but look at the Inquisition. Look at this.

Look at, look at what happened to the, to the Native Americans. And I was like, yes, yes, it's terrible. They're atrocities, you're right. What were they saying?

We're haunted by Christianity in a bad way and I'm sick of it. Why is it haunting us in a good way? These are the questions I want to pursue in the next six weeks. That's why I want to get at these questions.

If we drive at these questions, like why was the way he lived so haunting in a good way that people chose to go with him even at great cost to themselves? They didn't bring harm to others. They were willing to have arm out come to them.

Christianity was the most legit thing because these answers matter to ordinary people on Monday and Tuesday, not just Sunday. For these people, Jesus wasn't a ghost story, a myth or a theory. He was a dead man walking who haunted and saved people.

And like I said, he wants to haunt us and save us too, in a good way. Like I said, I just wanted to introduce this today.

I hope that you'll keep coming back for the whole series as we explore these questions and pursue this mystery. Let's pray. Lord, I pray that you would help us to see you in a way that we never have before.

I mean that, Lord, help us all to see you in a way we never have before. To discover your healing and hope like we never have before.

To know what it means that you save, to experience that and to offer it as a blessing to the world. It's in Jesus name I pray. Amen. I would invite you to stand and.

Speaker D: 00:42:10

Sing this with us. This is a another new song I was talking about.

Speaker A: 00:42:13

It's called Made for More.

Speaker D: 00:42:19

Taking the words and as we think ahead, answering some of these questions or.

Speaker A: 00:42:26

Even just kind of working through them.

Speaker D: 00:42:35

Just exploring this idea that.

Speaker B: 00:42:41

There'S a.

Speaker A: 00:42:41

Depth of purpose that we have.

Speaker D: 00:42:57

Cause.

I know who you are the cross of salvation was only the star Now I am chosen free and forgiven I have a future and it's worth the living cause I wasn't made to be tempting a grave I was called by name Born and raised back to life again I was made for more.

Speaker A: 00:43:53

So.

Speaker D: 00:43:54

Why would I make a bend my shame When a fountain of grace is running my way I know I am yours I was made for more.

Speaker A: 00:44:12

I.

Speaker D: 00:44:12

Know I am cuz I know who you are the cross of salvation.

Speaker A: 00:44:26

Was.

Speaker D: 00:44:27

Only the sun Now I am chosen free and forgiven I have a future and it's worth the living cause I wasn't made to be 10 in a grave I was called by name Born and raised back to life again I was faithful why would I make a bend my shame When a mountain of grace is running my way I know I am yours I was made for more Hallelujah you call my name thanks to my singer your praise Hallelujah you buried my past I'm not going back I wasn't made to be 10 in the grave I was called by name Born and raised back to life again I was made for more so why would I make a bed of my shame When a fountain of face cause running my way I know I am yours and I was made for more why would I make so why would I make a bed in my shame When a fountain of grace is running my way I know I am yours and I was made for more.

Speaker C: 00:46:48

So.

Speaker A: 00:46:51

I was just Is this on? Yes, There we go. Our church dreams of being a legitimate church.

That's why we say we want to exact we exist to make a lasting impact in our community and our church has. I just want to make it known we've been a friend to atheists.

At one time our greatest evangelist was an atheist friend in the community who invited people to our church. That's the reason that Sloan was here from Sloan's Corners because they were invited by an atheist. So that's part of this series too.

We want to like keep driving toward being that legitimate church. Thank you for being with us today.

I pray that you take the light of Jesus with you and that he continues to haunt you with his goodness in this season. Have a good week.

Speaker B: 00:47:48

Thank you for participating in the conversation happening at Heaven Earth Church.

Your next opportunity to do so live is this Sunday morning, 9:30am Eastern Time, either at the main campus at 309 East Main in Whiteland, Indiana or online at YouTube Live. That's@YouTube.com Heaven Earth Church. The audio podcast is always available at Apple Podcast and on Spotify.

You can help others find out about the Heaven Earth Church podcast by going to Apple Podcasts and or Spotify and leaving a five star rating and your review instructions on how to do just that and links are in the show notes. You can always find out more by going to the church website heavenearthchurch.org we.

Speaker A: 00:48:46

Want to thank you for spending time with us today My name is Ross Stackhouse, the pastor to Heaven Earth Church, and you may think out there that your story is over, but in fact, your faith story may just be beginning.

If you want more information about our church or you're interested in the next step, you can go to heavenearthchurch.org Otherwise, we look forward to being with you next time at the Heaven Earth Church podcast.